March 20, 2023

705: Say Goodbye to Complicated Taxes with the FairTax

@MikeSaliba12 & The @FairTaxOfficial Revolution - A Better Way to Do Taxes

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Do you ever get that sinking feeling when you think about filing your taxes? It's a tedious and complicated process that takes up a significant chunk of your time and money. Well, what if we told you that there's a better way to do taxes, one that's simpler, fairer, and more efficient?

On the latest episode of The Brian Nichols Show, Mike Salibajoins Brianto discuss the FairTax system, an alternative to the traditional income tax and sales tax system. This revolutionary tax system would change the way we think about taxes and potentially generate economic growth in the process.

But how does it work? The FairTax system is a single point-of-sale consumption tax on new goods and services that would replace the existing income tax, gift tax, estate tax, Social Security tax, and Medicare tax. This means thatinstead of paying taxes on your income, you would only pay taxes when you purchase goods and services. Sounds fair, right?

Mikeand Briandiscuss how the FairTaxsystem would be beneficial to the economy and create a simplified tax system. They also talk about how this system is equitable, as all individuals would pay the same amount, regardless of their income level. Plus, it would be more efficient than the current tax system, as it would reduce the number of loopholes, deductions, and credits.

But that's not all! The FairTaxsystem has bipartisan support and appeals to Republicans, Democrats, Libertarians, and independents alike. It would also eliminate the tax advantage of coming to the country without documentation and create a financial incentive to do so above board.

So, if you're tired of the traditional income tax system and want a better way to do taxes, tune in to The Brian Nichols Show to learn more about the FairTaxsystem. Trust us, your wallet (and your sanity) will thank you.


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Brian Nichols  0:00  
Hi. Can we do taxation differently? Yeah, let's talk about that. Instead of focusing on winning arguments, we're teaching the basic fundamentals of sales and marketing and how we can use them to win in the world of politics teaching you how to meet people where they're at on the issues they care about. Welcome to The Brian Nichols Show. Hey there, folks, Brian Nichols, here on The Brian Nichols Show. And thank you for joining us on of course, another fun filled episode. I am as always your humble host. Joining us live from our B and C Studios here in lovely Eastern Indiana. Don't let your business sales strategies fail you as we approach a looming recession. Guys, it's coming. So if you want to get your sales and prospecting strategies up to snuff, learn more by emailing me at Brian at Brian Nichols. All right, let's talk about taxation. We've here in the libertarian sphere, especially taxation, what is it? It's that, but what if there was a possible middle ground that we can get some of the quote unquote normies on board with? Well, I think we're gonna have some luck with that today because joining us talking about the fair tax might Saliba, welcome to The Brian Nichols Show. Hey,

Mike Saliba  1:29  
Brian, thanks for having me.

Brian Nichols  1:30  
Absolutely. Mike, thank you for joining us looking forward to digging into all things fair tax. Now we did have Steve Hayes, who he knows all things about fair tax on the show back mid last year, pretty much a an intro into what is the fair tax? How does it work? Why is it different than our traditional income tax slash sales tax system? With that, though, if you could do us a favor, Mike, just kind of reintroduce the topic as you introduce yourself here to The Brian Nichols Show audience. Okay, so

Mike Saliba  1:59  
the basic rundown on the fair tax is it's a single point of sale consumption tax. That's only on new goods and retail services. It replaces our existing income tax, including corporate income tax, personal income tax, gift tax, estate tax, Social Security tax, Medicare tax, and completely replaces the IRS and calls for the abolishment of the 16th amendment that allows direct taxation to exist in our Constitution, which had previously not been allowed. And if you want to keep it revenue neutral, meaning the government still collects the same amount of money that it's collecting now, from all those other sources of taxation, it's 23% of every dollar you spend on new goods and services, will end up going to the federal government. But that's actually not so bad. Since as of right now, about 22% of everything you spend, goes to either the federal government or the cost of complying with the federal government.

Brian Nichols  3:03  
Might do us a favor, break down those numbers. So 22% Currently, is that counting? So is this apples to apples comparison of the 23%? Or is it actually going to be less pain because we're not paying in other areas?

Mike Saliba  3:14  
It's, it's exactly it's less pain, because that 22% doesn't all get collected by the government. But it goes to the cost of filing with the government complying with the government. Everything you buy every step of the way, gets that tacked on, for instance, just an example, I used to work for an energy drink company, we made a little energy shot. We made everything we had an accountant, we paid corporate taxes, payroll taxes, but one company made our label, one company made the bottle, one company made the cap, one company made the food dye one company made the flavors one company made the supplements inside, all of those pay corporate taxes, all those collect their employees, payroll taxes, and all of those people hire CPAs to do it for them, either, you know, as third party resources or as employees in their companies. Pretty much because our existing tax code is over 160,000 pages. We spend about $800 billion a year just to comply with it and do the labor of filing it with the FairTax. Any of those other background companies would not pay any taxes because they're just doing business to business transactions. Like they're selling us the cap. They're selling us the label, they're selling us the ingredients. We're selling it to the distributor who sells it to the grocery store, and the grocery store. When you buy it is the only entity that even collects tax to send to the government. And it's just they set their register so that 23% gets stowed away for the government and that's it. That's the only level At which taxes are collected.

Brian Nichols  5:02  
So this sounds kind of like a common sense middle ground, but I'm sure there must be some objections because, well, we don't have it yet. So talk to us about what you're hearing, you're going out there talking to people both on the left and the right. I mean, I'm sure there's been mixed feedback, what would you say are some of the top concerns you're hearing.

Mike Saliba  5:20  
So that's the best thing about the FairTax. It was first introduced into Congress in 1999. But the most important thing to know right now is it's finally coming for the first time to a vote on the floor of the house sometime this summer. So even though it's been in committee for 24 years, that has given it the time to be the most researched bill in Congress, including dozens and dozens of independent studies showing the effectiveness and benefits of the sales tax. So just the background on me, I was a Libertarian candidate for Congress in my district. And I spent a lot of my campaigning just knocking on doors. And I pretty much only knocked on doors in areas where in past elections, I got up above like the 6%. Mark. But okay, that's high for a libertarian, but that means 94% of the people didn't vote for me, which means they voted probably for a Republican or a Democrat. And so when I was, you know, knocking on the door, somebody would answer somebody was either a Republican or a Democrat. And because of the bipartisan nature of the sales tax, when it was introduced in 1999, it had an equal number of Republican and Democrat co sponsors. So there is something for every Republicans, Democrat, Libertarian and independent in it. And sometimes that would automatically present itself. So let's say I knock on the door, it's a Republican. The Republican asked me what my border policy is, I'm a libertarian, I probably don't have the same border policy as he does. But I say, Oh, but I support the fair tax. And with the fair tax, since all taxation is collected at the cash register, when you buy things, there is no tax advantage to coming into the country under without documentation. That is one of the main reasons why you would want to come to America without documentation, because once you get the documentation, you start getting money taken out your paycheck, right. But for him, he actually really liked that. You know, I think somebody who is concerned about people coming in over the border, they always say, well, they're using our system, but they're not paying for it under the fair tax, they're actually paying higher, because they don't get a monthly prebate check that everybody with a social security number, or employer ID number, employee ID number will get to offset all poverty level taxation. So it's actually creates a financial incentive for anybody coming to this country to do so above the board. Another thing I got several times, I was going out with standard Libertarian Party door hangers, and it mentioned privatize Social Security, Democrats, not a fan. But guess what, I support the fair tax. And because the fair tax collects the same amount from everybody. What we have now Social Security, only employees pay into the Social Security fund. And it gets capped at a certain level. People who live off of trust funds don't pay into Social Security, people who live off of capital gains don't pay into Social Security. People who just they're the owner of their business, don't necessarily pay into Social Security past what they might be paying themselves out on a paycheck. Whereas under the FairTax, everybody pays into the Social Security. And the number of people who pay into it increases. And it is actually a pretty good stopgap measure. I think most libertarians know that the Social Security Trust Fund will not will be underfunded and bankrupt pretty much within the next 11 years, under the FairTax gets a big new flush of money and gives us time to at least pay the people it was promised to which even though I would like to privatize Social Security and kind of do away with the federal government aspect of it. There's people who've been paying into it their whole entire lives, and we kind of need to make good on the contract we had with them for doing that. And the fair tax is something that does that.

Brian Nichols  9:37  
Yeah, we have to have this kind of middle ground and this isn't to be squishy, pragmatic. None of those labels like this is to help make it possible. Right. Like I'll give you a real life example. In my day job. I will go down with IT directors Chief Information Officers CFOs and we're walking through really intense cybersecurity telecommuting. cations contact center solutions. And a lot of this stuff takes time, energy and effort to switch over, if you're going from a legacy phone solution to a brand new hosted VoIP solution, and you're integrating your contact center with all these brand new, fancy features and functionality, you think there's gonna be a little bit of a learning curve on behalf not just of the people actually using the software, but now your customers, right. So to be able to migrate over to a new solution, where it's not just ripping the band aid off, but actually helping make sure that people are understanding it, they're seeing the value, but also that's working, right. And I guess, speaking to this incrementalist approach, almost this is that middle ground, because it eliminates a lot of the concerns that I would say both the left and the right are often going to bring to the table here. And we're presenting things in a very cohesive, but also common sense approach, Mike, and I think right there, that is where we have the most opportunity is entering into these conversations with common sense solutions. Because the other two parties, they're not having that conversation. They're more focused on the polarizing topics, like you mentioned, immigration, or social security, like let's talk about how to actually solve these problems. But that's the thing, not just talk now actually show that there is a viable alternative. So with that being said, Where do you think, Stan, how is the FairTax currently moving through? And so there's a vote coming up, but do we actually have any hope that this will go through and Congress?

Mike Saliba  11:25  
So right now, you know, as you remember, there was the big fight for the Speaker of the House that led to a lot of backroom negotiations. Somebody that I kind of always saw speaking into the ear was actually Thomas Massie, Thomas Massie, Matt gates, and Marjorie Taylor Greene are the kind of most notable co signers of the current FairTax right now. It was weird when Marjorie Taylor GreenStar supporting because I'm like, I agree with Marjorie Taylor Greene on something but part of getting speaker McCarthy speaker was that this has to come to the floor at some point. And we're predicting that to be in late summer. It started out as a bipartisan bill. It has only pretty much had Republican support for the last several years because Nancy Pelosi put out a memo to the Democrats that they were not to support this. But Nancy is not really calling the shots anymore. I'm sure she's still very influential within that caucus. But it's no longer a death sentence for a Democrat to say, Hey, I think a bill that saves Social Security and lowers the cost of college tuition by 40%. And on taxes the poor and makes Donald Trump pay more than $750 in taxes is a good thing. I think we can pull a few Democrats over it probably I don't know if it would pass this round. But it would really put a lot of the city and Congress people on record as whether or not they've supported it. Let me give you another example. In my last election, the difference between the winner and the loser the Republican and the Democrat was 16 102 votes, but I got 3500 votes. And so John James in my district here in Michigan, the Republican, he could co sign this as a Republican, it's a little bit easier for you to co sign this than a Democrat. But he knows he had a thin margin last time and he wants to get reelected and he needs to do something to steal some of Mike's votes if he wants a little bit more room. And one of the things he can do is cosign the FairTax. And, you know, here in Michigan, we are kind of lucky to have the only libertarian to serve in Congress as a libertarian, Justin Amash. And he was at one of our past state conventions. And he said, something that I thought was really interesting was like, it only took five phone calls from our constituents for us to think something was important. Wow. So right now, if you are listening to this, if you have a Republican representative in Congress, or you have a Democrat, representing you in Congress, get you and five of your friends, four of your friends to call them up and say, It's hr 25, the FairTax you can give them anything you want for a Republican or Democrat I can provide tell them what it will do for you and why they need to cosign on it and vote for it when it comes to the floor. And if you're a libertarian, I've heard all the tax I'm I'm I'm a radical libertarian. I'm a member of the radical caucus I believe in a very, very small to no government but Rothbard button isn't going to be on the floor of Congress this summer, the fair taxes and it eliminates the IRS and the income tax, something we've been trying to do since 1972.

Brian Nichols  15:08  
Little steps in the right direction, right? Well talk to us about when we're going out and reaching to some other voters. And I think this is an approach I would recommend, I want to hear your perspective as a former candidate is, I like the Scott Horton approach you take on the left and the left and the right from the right, and you enter into those conversations with the emotional triggers that you know, are going to get them to take action. So Mike, what are you seeing as some of those emotional triggers that we can focus on and actually have success in getting our message to these different voters?

Mike Saliba  15:40  
Oh, the big one I, for the Democrats, I also just mentioned social security. But also yes, it does. Because of all the embedded taxes in attending university, the price of tuition, they want free tuition, let me lower it by 40%. I can do that with the FairTax. As far as Republicans are concerned, they're typically think of themselves as the small government. And their Republicans are being really turned on to the weaponization of the alphabet boy type committees. You know, we've seen back in oh nine, the Obama administration, or the IRS under the Obama administration was found to be targeting tea party organizations with audits. But you can do the same thing going back to Nixon, where people on Nixon's enemies list were getting audited at a higher rate. Same thing goes, you can go back now to the Democrats, it's actually poor people who get audited at a five times higher rate than rich people. And it's actually people of color that are double that across the board. You know, the IRS isn't just somebody who collects money, they collect information. During the Bush administration, the Democrats were very much against mass surveillance. But now the IRS wants to know, every time you spend $600, going back to Republicans, it makes starting a small business so much easier, especially if your small business isn't necessarily even going to be operating at the retail level. You never you never have to file taxes, if you're not operating at the retail level. If you are operating at the retail level, for instance, I own a retail business, I sell online, all I have to do to comply with federal taxation will be to set it so that 23% of my money just goes aside for taxes. There we go. I filed taxes. I didn't have to, I didn't have to report who I spent money with. I didn't have to report my deductions devaluations, this or that I didn't have to comply with 160,000 pages of code, I had to comply with 130 pages of code

Brian Nichols  18:00  
$800 billion you spent on tax? That's That's insane. For tax preparing $800 billion, where could that money be invested? Right? I mean, think about that, from a just a person standpoint, if I gave you a billion dollars, right? Not even $800 billion. What could you do with that and think about the amount of positive that can come from us getting rid of this added layer of bureaucracy, this added layer of really, I mean, it's it's infringement on our ability to live our lives, right. And we have to start looking at it like that way. It's holding us back from taking opportunities or taking chances that we wouldn't otherwise be able to take so I guess no, that's my kind of final thoughts is we're going toward the tail end of the episode today, Mike, where do you kind of want to leave things as we wrap things up with a nice bow here for the episode?

Mike Saliba  18:49  
If you want to learn more about the fair tax checkout fair Since you're listening to The Brian Nichols Show, I already know you like podcast, check out FairTax power radio, they're on every week as a podcast and terrestrial radio. They provide a lot of good information. If you want to learn more about the Libertarian Party check out and Michigan is having our state convention on April 1 in Lansing, you can come I'll have a lot of FairTax information there if you happen to live in Michigan. And you can follow me at Saliba know what's my website? Oh, gosh, this is bad. It's too far after election season. I'm elect Mike's leave on Facebook. I'm at Mike's Liva 12 on Twitter, and I'm vote for my website. No worries,

Brian Nichols  19:37  
Mike, we're gonna make it easy for folks. No, they don't have to go through and we'll be writing that down. We're going to have all in the show notes. So folks, if you're joining us here on the podcast version of the show, which I know 99% of you are give me a favor click that artwork in the podcast catcher is going to bring you over to the website. We're going to find today's episode, the entire transcript for today's episode as we mentioned all Mike's Affer mentioned links plus and this is the most important part you are going to find that Video version of the show surprise, we have a video version. I know rumble Odyssey and YouTube, just do me a favor, hit that subscribe button and a little notification bell so you don't miss a single time we go live. And by the way, I have a question for you guys. What happened in 1971? Do you know, there's a lot of things that happened in 1971. And a lot of those things not so good. So if you want to ask that question and get other people to get asking that question as well, head to Brian Nichols forward slash shop and grab your what happened in 1971 shirt today use CO T B and S for 10% off at checkout. And as we wrap things up to here today, we mentioned we had a great conversation with Steve Hays also talking all things with the FairTax. So if you're joining us, you're on the YouTube version of the show. We're going to continue the conversation right there. The video should be popping up right about here. So do me a favor, click that link. We'll see you over there. But otherwise, it's Brian Nichols signing off. You're on The Brian Nichols Show for Mike Saliba. We'll see you tomorrow. Thanks

Transcribed by

MIke SalibaProfile Photo

MIke Saliba

4 time Libertarian candidate for public office.
Founder of Libertarians of Macomb County (MI)
Chair of Libertarian Party of Michigan